The Pains of Being Pure at Heart Are Beating Again » PopMatters
The Pains of Being Pure at Heart are back together again, and two of the indie rock-pop band’s founding members discuss their past, present, and future.
Perfect Right Now The Pains of Being Pure at Heart Slumberland 7 February 2025
An indie rock-pop band with the power to stop the rain surely must have some heavenly connections. The Pains of Being Pure at Heart, fronted by founder, lead singer, and guitarist Kip Berman, practically proved to possess such divine abilities on a Sunday afternoon in Salt Lake City, of all places.
At least during a wet day that began with heavy showers, as Kilby Block Party was closing out their music festival on 18 May. A fine lineup included sweet solo artists like Orla Gartland (laughing in the rain), Beeson, and Suki Waterhouse, along with competing kick-ass bands Geese and TV on the Radio near the end of the night.
By then, the rain had ended, and the spunky group with the seven-word name must have had something to do with it. Drops continued to fall when Berman and Co. took the spacious Kilby Stage at 3:00 pm, but 15 minutes later, the sun was shining brightly upon the small but supportive and appreciative crowd. Peggy Wang, the cofounder, keyboardist, and vocalist of the Pains of Being Pure at Heart, a ray of sunshine, kindly responded to a spectator who wanted to know the name of the song just performed.
“The Tenure Itch”, she said radiantly of the Pains’ fifth tune that continued the same running order of the Pains of Being Pure at Heart‘s self-titled, full-length debut album, which they released on 3 February 2009.
Berman finally addressed the crowd, too, noting the obvious thanks to festival clock watchers. “There isn’t a lot of time to rehearse banter,” he wryly said to applause and laughter. “But I do like that the sun is coming out for this. (Huge cheers) Big fan of the sun. You’ve got Pains in the rains, so that’s OK; thanks guys, thank you.”
With that pronouncement, the Pains of Being Pure at Heart were officially back. Their power pop combination of catchy hooks, raspy vocals, and grungy reverb is reminiscent of 1980s-era Replacements and Soul Asylum. Though it’s 2025, the New York City-based band that also includes guitarist Christoph Hochheim, drummer Kurt Feldman, and touring bassist Eddy Marshall, are quietly extending the 15th-year anniversary of that landmark record.
They have other reasons to celebrate, too. The reunion of the original members, with bassist Alex Naidus returning after the baby daddy leaves, continues to be commemorated following the Pains’ breakup in October 2019. Perhaps their return lacks the publicity weight of Rilo Kiley, the Jenny Lewis-fronted outfit whose tour, including a Kilby stop two days earlier, is gaining massive attention—and deservedly so.
Yet the painstaking approach by Berman, who departed to focus on a solo-oriented project called The Natvral, might be the way for them to go. A new studio album or more grand covers (like Tom Petty’s Full Moon Fever LP, James’ “Laid” on their Hell release) haven’t been announced, but Perfect Right Now, a compilation of rarities, lost tracks, and b-sides, was released on 7 February. And after two dates last week in Italy, they won’t hit the road again (at least according to the current schedule) until November, when they play at least ten shows in the United Kingdom, but none in the US.
What can audiences across the pond expect besides the double-pronged Berman-Hochheim guitar attack on hard-charging thrashers like “Come Saturday” and “Young Adult Friction”? Revealing details while predicting fans’ reaction in his Kilby mini-preview for PopMatters before their SLC date, Berman offered, ”Stepping on fuzz pedals and playing the E chord, possibly with the A chord and even a B chord every now and again. Twelve people will be like, ‘They are my ‘favorite band,’ and the rest of the people will just be there camping out early waiting for Justice.” (The over-the-top, Paris-based EDM duo somehow grabbed the festival’s closing slot on the same Kilby Stage after their seven-year hiatus.)
Berman and Wang also addressed the past, present, and future of their group in our email Q&A sessions held days before the 18 May set. They responded separately to a list of mostly different questions, which were blended together in an attempt at cohesion. For saving what could have been a dreary day, let the Sun King be the first to turn on the light.
Back in Business
Tell me how you brought the Pains of Being Pure at Heart back together last year for the 15th anniversary of your debut album.
Kip: I got asked if we’d be up for doing some shows in Spain this year, and I thought that sounded really cool. Whatever reasons I had for not doing it seemed like “dumb reasons” — the kind of reasons you can’t exactly explain, because they are, in fact, “dumb reasons”. So I said I’d check with the others, and thankfully, they were all down to play.
Last year, when I was DJing at Slide Away Fest, Nicky (Palermo) from Nothing was so enthusiastic about us playing his festival this year that we had to do it. We didn’t really think things out beyond that.
With Peggy Wang and Kurt Feldman back, along with former touring guitarist Christoph Hochheim, which other musicians have been added since the reunion announcement?
Kip: It’s all of us OGs — and Christoph is a full member of the band now, too. But (bassist) Alex (Naidus) had a child recently, so Eddy Marshall (who toured with us in Spain and plays with me in the Natvral) is filling in on bass for these (May) dates, and Alex will join us again when we go to the UK later this year.
How did you find out the Pains of Being Pure at Heart were reuniting? How often did you stay in touch with Kip during the band’s “hiatus”?
Peggy: I still saw all of the original members of Pains somewhat regularly throughout the “hiatus”. I would say they are still some of my very good friends! The reunion came about because our promoter in Spain had approached Kip with the idea of doing some 15th anniversary shows. I hadn’t realllly thought about it, but when someone asks you if you want to go to Spain for two weeks, it’s not something you turn down. Getting to play Kilby then just fell into place. We never got to spend much time in Salt Lake City, which is why I wanted to stay a bit longer and do some things.
I understand that you were good friends in New York City before the band formed. How did you become one of the founding members in 2007?
Peggy: Kip and I met through a mutual friend — one of those instant connections where it was like, “Wait, you like salad? I like salad! You’re into this obscure indie pop band from Leeds you found on MySpace? I am too!” It’s easy to take for granted how effortlessly friendships were formed back then. We started going to shows together, hanging out at Cake Shop, eating at all the East Village spots that don’t exist anymore.
At some point, Kip posted a few demos on MySpace, and suddenly, we were in a band, along with Alex, who was his coworker at the time. I’d played in a bunch of bands before, but Kip had a clear vision from the start: where we should take our first photos, where we would book our first show (in an empty warehouse space, on my birthday, with the above band from Leeds, naturally). Because we were already friends, we had a shared sensibility that made it easy to build something together.
How has the music business changed since you formed the band in 2007?
Kip: I don’t know. Could someone plz tell me? LOL
The Pains of Being Pure at Heart Name Game
The origin story of The Pains of Being Pure at Heart’s name (from an unpublished children’s story written by a friend of Berman’s) is well known, and Kip must have brought it to the group, but was a vote taken, were there alternate choices, and what was your initial reaction?
Peggy: Coming up with a band name is a very demeaning process. You just sit there throwing out bad ideas and feeling like a pathetic try-hard loser. I’m genuinely thankful we never had to go through that. We didn’t put up a fight or try to come up with something else. This was the 2000s, baby! We were coming off bands like “…And You Will Know Us by the Trail of Dead” and “I Love You But I’ve Chosen Darkness”. But personally, I’d rather have a band name that stood for something, that defined us, rather than something forced and random. OK, was I embarrassed to say out loud the first few times? For sure, but I got over it, and honestly, it kind of filters out the h8ers. If the name makes you cringe, we were probably never meant to be in each other’s lives anyway.
Other than your Instagram announcement announcing the breakup on 4 November 2019, what details are you able to share about the decision?
Kip: I posted that a bit randomly — my daughter was born a couple of months after we recorded our last record in 2016, and I really didn’t do much music after that. When I started writing songs again, they sounded pretty unrecognizable. I didn’t want to use any pedals or elaborate setup; I just wanted to make the sort of music that requires nothing but myself to create, and can be made anywhere. I know it sounds a bit “eye-roll,” but it felt like I was a different person at that time of my life, and the new songs I was writing were just really different. So, after my son was born in 2018, I started putting my new music out as the Natvral and figured I wasn’t going to be doing Pains anymore.
What was your reaction when the band broke up in 2019? Did you see it coming?
Peggy: I didn’t see it coming! I hadn’t played in the band for some time at that point. It was bittersweet but also nice in the sense that I got a lot of text messages from old friends that day.
How easy or difficult was it to get the band back together? Were some bandmates more receptive than others to reuniting?
Kip: Everyone seemed tres cool.
How long did it take to get in the groove again on the Portugal/Spain tour earlier this year? How did the crowds react to the reunion?
Kip: For whatever reason, people in Spain have always been some of the most enthusiastic people about Pains. I never know the reason, but something about what we do just connects with people there. So seeing people who have been there from the start and are adults now, still being so enthusiastic, was heartening. If anything, it made me realize that adults in Spain still have fun, and Americans can learn a lesson from that. We need more parties in the USA.
Before that group of dates, when was the last tour for the Pains of Being Pure at Heart?
Kip: I think we did a few shows for The Echo of Pleasure in 2017 when that album came out, but my daughter was only one and a half years old, so I didn’t want to be away or do much with the band. Now she’s nine, her favorite animal is the buffalo, and with a running head start, she can knock me over. My son is six (he loves hedgehogs and can’t quite knock me over yet), and they both seem sturdy enough for me to go play a few shows with Pains.
Looking Ahead
How far do you plan to take this? What are you hoping to accomplish the second time around?
Kip: We don’t really have a plan … it’s just cool to play our songs if people wanna hear ‘em.
What led to your decision to do it, and what has been the most intriguing development since reforming?
Kip: I Costanza’d it (for all the Seinfeld fans out there). All my normal decisions were going badly for a while, so when I was asked to do some shows, I decided to just do the opposite of what I’d normally do. Instead of “No, I’m going to stay home and cry in my cardigan,” I was like, “Cool, OK, yeah!”
What other projects are planned for the immediate future?
Kip: We are going to play in the UK in November with Cassie Ramone, and I think a festival in Jakarta called Joyland after that. The thing I said about Spain is also true about Indonesia — since our MySpace days, we’ve gotten so many messages from fans in Indonesia, and there’s this incredible music scene there — bands like Tossing Seed, the Bunbury, Pastel Badge, White Shoes and the Couples Company, Drizzly, and so many more. For the type of music we make, the scene there seems the most happening!
What are your US touring plans for the rest of this year? A January release listed only two US dates, including Kilby Block Party, and the band’s website has since added Italy this month and the United Kingdom in November.
Kip: We don’t have any other US dates. I wanted Slide Away to be really special and just see how things felt before agreeing to anything else. But the UK tour with Cassie Ramone (Vivian Girls, Babies) is going to be great, as we’re big fans of her bands and solo tunes, and she’s always been cool to us.
How satisfying has your work with the Natvral been? What plans do you have to continue that project and possibly collaborate with others outside the Pains of Being Pure at Heart? If you’re serious about collaborating elsewhere, what effect will that have on your commitment to the Pains?
Kip: I got some songs I really like, and hopefully I can make a new record soon.
But there’s this thing I see where a lot of artists start to lose their relevance and get a bit desperate and act resentful — or worse, take up reactionary political stances as if it’s simply some artistic reinvention to play to a new audience, not a complete selling of their soul.
The things that really matter if you’re a person who makes songs are making good songs. That’s it, that’s what you do — so try to make some good songs, and don’t become a total dickhead.
How committed are you to staying on tour this year if other US dates are booked? What do you like most (and least) about touring?
Peggy: Currently, we don’t have any other shows booked until November. I’m kind of sad about it! But it’s honestly nice that we can kind of play some shows here and there and take a break from our regular lives to do something cool and exciting. I think my favorite feeling is actually after playing the show. The nerves are gone, and I can just relax and finally have my glass of wine or whatever.
Now that I’m older and a little more precious with my time, I like to go out of my way to experience things in every city. My least favorite thing is my own fault, which is that I’m no longer low-maintenance. I have a lot of routines and little things I do when I wake up, before bed, and getting ready that are more difficult to maintain on tour. I didn’t use to be like this!
Other than your roles in BuzzFeed and Store Front, what else did you do to stay busy during that time away from the band? What kind of day jobs did you have, and which one did you enjoy the most?
Peggy: I’m basically the first employee at BuzzFeed, and I still work there! So now I kind of have a lot of responsibility and can’t really do much else. Probably my longest-lasting hobby is ceramics, and I had dreams of doing it in a full-time capacity. That probably won’t happen anytime soon, but it would be cool to make it onto The Great Pottery Throw Down someday. Right now, I’m really into doing my own Japanese gel manicures. It’s actually a very deep hobby to get lost in.
What groups did you admire when you were growing up? Which one inspired you to become a musician?
Peggy: I think Sonic Youth was the first band I made my whole personality. It was harder to find out about things back then, and Sonic Youth did a lot of curation, and I would become obsessed with anything that was part of their world. It’s how I then got into Kill Rock Stars, K Records, all sorts of other stuff that I never would have known about otherwise. All my favorite bands had women in them: Helium, the Breeders, the Sundays. Watching Kim Deal in the “Cannonball” video had a huge effect on me. She made playing bar chords look easy. I took some guitar lessons and asked my teacher, “Can you teach me how to play this Velocity Girl song?” He was like, ‘No.’”
Memorable Moments
How familiar were you with the Kilby Block Party? What did you know about it before you were booked to play it?
Kip: I didn’t know about the modern festival until we were invited. But we played Kilby Court back in the day (13 September 2009), and I remember playing F-Zero on the SNES before the show in a living room area, then afterwards going to find where Titus Andronicus were playing nearby (Provo) and drinking 3% beer with them. It was our only time in Utah, but it was genuinely pretty cool.
Also, I want to give a shout-out to an MP3 blog called the Yellow Stereo in SLC that used to hype us up in the early days. Thank you for liking our tunes back then and sharing ‘em with people.
You share a common bond with Rilo Kiley, who reunited this year to resume touring for the first time in 17 years, and performed at Kilby. How well do you know them, and have you ever had the chance to compare notes?
Kip: I recently watched Troop Beverly Hills with my children, and Jenny Lewis is the kid in that! Seriously, a classic, and crazy to think about the unusual way her life has gone — I don’t know the band personally, but Jenny seems legit cool, and her solo music is really lovely as well.
What’s the most memorable moment you’ve experienced in the Pains of Being Pure at Heart?
Peggy: Hmm. People usually like the story about when we played Coachella and shared a golf cart to the stage with Paul McCartney. Someone working the fest was approving credentials and asked, “What band are you in?” And he just gave a sly little smile and said, “All of them.”
After almost a year back together, how do you feel about your decision to come back, and what significant differences within the group have you noticed from the early years?
Kip: We’ve done two weeks of shows, so I don’t know. … I’m hopeful we can play more.
How long would you like the Pains of Being Pure at Heart to last this time around?
Peggy: For now, I’m enjoying doing the bits of shows that we’re doing. I had missed it a lot! I have to say, it’s really fun to play these songs again. I was worried that so much time had passed that I wasn’t sure if I’d still “feel” it on stage. But it all came rushing back, and during our first tour back, it was really life-affirming to see how much our first album meant to people.
What’s the most refreshing thing that has happened within the band or to you since coming back?
Kip: It’s just cool to get to be around my friends again and realize people still like these songs.
In announcing the breakup in 2019, you said, “My life has changed radically from the time I started Pains.” Looking back, did it change for the better, and how much has it changed in the past six years?
Kip: Maybe it’s not so different? I used to be driving a van with moody people in their 20s. Now I’m driving moody people in their late single digits, but either way, people still fight over what we listen to on the radio.
Bonus Question
If you could have spent more time at the Kilby Block Party, which artist(s) would you have liked to see perform? And why?
Kip: I really like that Cameron Winter record, and I saw Geese was playing there, and he’s also in that band, so I’d definitely check them out.
Yo La Tengo’s Painful was on constant rotation for me and Peggy when we started the band, and they’ve done loads of great records. They deserve to be held in the highest esteem, but I think they’re playing a different day than we are, so I won’t get to see them.
Peggy: I’m planning on attending Friday through Sunday! It’s honestly been ages since I’ve been to a music festival, so I plan on making the most of my time. My top bands to see are: Slowdive, Wishy, Being Dead, George Clanton, and Nourished By Time. I’ve actually seen most of those bands already, but that’s what’s fun about it — I already know the songs front to back. Built to Spill and Weezer, also. I’m excited to see them and sing along to every word. A video popped up on my TikTok feed of Weezer doing “The Sweater Song” on Conan in 1994, and they are doing the “background talking” part live. So sick.